A friend posted this on Facebook today. Ordinarily I try not to deal with crazy people, but I had an issue I wanted to deal with.
Orly Taitz keeps going back to the point that Obama could not be a natural born citizen because his father was a Kenyan citizen. When she was on The Colbert Report, Colbert supported her saying it would mean going back to the days of Chester A. Arthur, whose father was not a U.S. citizen.
Then I wondered where she was coming from. So long as you were born in the United States, you are a natural born citizen and it does not matter whether your parents are. The rules for being a natural born citizen have some variation depending on where you where born. As territories joined the United States, laws were established saying who were the natural born citizens of the U.S.
For example, here is part of the U.S. code that deals with those born in Hawaii:
"A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30, 1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900."
But it says nothing about what the citizenship of the parents must be.
So, what is Orly Taitz trying to say?
Well, here is the section of the U.S. Code that spells out natural born citizen. It defines a natural born citizen as:
If Obama was born in Hawaii, he meets that requirement. I've seen the birth certificate online, I'm satisfied. Also officials in the Hawaiian and federal government, as well as key Republican leaders have been satisfied with the documentation. (By the way, Happy Birthday, Mr. President!)
(b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe ... (doesn't apply here.)
(c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person;
OK, now this might be an issue, if it were proven that Obama was born outside the U.S. This criteria would not be met because his father was not a U.S. citizen.
OK, now this might be an issue, if it were proven that Obama was born outside the U.S. This criteria would not be met because his father was not a U.S. citizen.
(d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States;
No help for Obama under the Kenya birth scenario here. By the way, you can be a national of the U.S., but not a citizen. "A person whose only connection to the U.S. is through birth in an outlying possession (which as of 2005 is limited to American Samoa and Swains Island), or through descent from a person so born acquires U.S. nationality but not U.S. citizenship. This was formerly the case in only four other current or former U.S. overseas possessions[19]" (Sorry for the use of Wikipedia here.) But Obama's father had no claim of being a U.S. national.
No help for Obama under the Kenya birth scenario here. By the way, you can be a national of the U.S., but not a citizen. "A person whose only connection to the U.S. is through birth in an outlying possession (which as of 2005 is limited to American Samoa and Swains Island), or through descent from a person so born acquires U.S. nationality but not U.S. citizenship. This was formerly the case in only four other current or former U.S. overseas possessions[19]" (Sorry for the use of Wikipedia here.) But Obama's father had no claim of being a U.S. national.
(e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person;
Again, no help for Obama if he was born in Kenya.
Again, no help for Obama if he was born in Kenya.
(f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States;
This one doesn't affect us, but it has the makings of a good screenplay. A four-year-old child, found lost somewhere in the United States, grows up to run for president.
This one doesn't affect us, but it has the makings of a good screenplay. A four-year-old child, found lost somewhere in the United States, grows up to run for president.
(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person
(B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date;
If I read this one correctly, Obama born in Kenya would meet the requirements of a U.S. citizen. His mother was a U.S. citizen who was present in the U.S. long enough.
and (h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.
This one doesn't apply, but there's probably an interesting story behind where this rule came from.
So, what is the kindest way to express Orly Taitz' argument?
She has dismissed the documentation on Obama's birth in Hawaii, and is trying to make an argument that because Obama was born outside of the U.S., he had to meet one of the more difficult criteria for being a natural born citizen, which are listed above. However, she does not explain her position well and does not even understand the point of law that she is arguing.
I felt some sympathy for her during this interview because from one perspective, it would appear she is being badgered and not being allowed to make her point. But from the other side of it, the interviewers know that she has already made her arguments in the media. They were not there to give her yet another platform to state her case. They wanted to get her to respond to new perspectives, new questions. She wouldn't play it that way. She wanted to go to her standard stump speech, and she got stomped.
What I don't like is that because of all the air time she has acquired, the public is more confused about the standards for a natural born citizen. Some may actually think that to be natural born, you not only have to be born in the U.S., but also have both parents be U.S. citizens. That's just not true. Anyone born in the U.S. - even if the parents are illegal aliens - are natural born citizens.
I fear that Orly Taitz' arguments will be picked up by the fringe and used by other more hateful minds who want to make a case about who are the "real Americans."
If I read this one correctly, Obama born in Kenya would meet the requirements of a U.S. citizen. His mother was a U.S. citizen who was present in the U.S. long enough.
and (h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.
This one doesn't apply, but there's probably an interesting story behind where this rule came from.
So, what is the kindest way to express Orly Taitz' argument?
She has dismissed the documentation on Obama's birth in Hawaii, and is trying to make an argument that because Obama was born outside of the U.S., he had to meet one of the more difficult criteria for being a natural born citizen, which are listed above. However, she does not explain her position well and does not even understand the point of law that she is arguing.
I felt some sympathy for her during this interview because from one perspective, it would appear she is being badgered and not being allowed to make her point. But from the other side of it, the interviewers know that she has already made her arguments in the media. They were not there to give her yet another platform to state her case. They wanted to get her to respond to new perspectives, new questions. She wouldn't play it that way. She wanted to go to her standard stump speech, and she got stomped.
What I don't like is that because of all the air time she has acquired, the public is more confused about the standards for a natural born citizen. Some may actually think that to be natural born, you not only have to be born in the U.S., but also have both parents be U.S. citizens. That's just not true. Anyone born in the U.S. - even if the parents are illegal aliens - are natural born citizens.
I fear that Orly Taitz' arguments will be picked up by the fringe and used by other more hateful minds who want to make a case about who are the "real Americans."
When Ann Coulter and Karl Rove say you are crazy, that should end the discussion.
Oh wait, they'd say I'm crazy too. Oh no! I have become Orly Taitz!
And that, finally, is why you should not talk to crazy people. They make you crazy.
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